Watch This If You Have An E-Commerce Business

AAlex Hormozi
Advertising/MarketingSmall Business/StartupsManagementComputing/Software

Transcript

00:00:00"In 2021, I sold my e-commerce company Prestige Labs
00:00:02"with Jim Mullins for $46.2 million.
00:00:05"And six months ago, I broke the Guinness World Record
00:00:07"for the fastest selling nonfiction book
00:00:09"and generated over $106 million in a weekend
00:00:10"just using a Shopify store."
00:00:12And so in this video, I'm answering your questions
00:00:14about how to scale your e-commerce business.
00:00:16And for all these questions, I've tried to do my very best
00:00:18to make the solutions as tactical as humanly possible
00:00:20so that you watching from home can immediately use them.
00:00:22So enjoy.
00:00:22- Hey, Alex. - Yes.
00:00:24- My name is Max.
00:00:25I run Elevate Customs with my wife, who's in the front row.
00:00:29It's a-
00:00:30- Elevate Customs? - Yep.
00:00:32- Like customs, sorry.
00:00:34Like home custom solutions?
00:00:36- No, we build and sell like luxury gaming tables,
00:00:38like pool tables, casino tables, manufacturer.
00:00:41- Not what I was saying.
00:00:42Okay, got it, yeah.
00:00:43That's cool.
00:00:45Like cool backlights and things like that.
00:00:47- Yeah, like anything, like one-off custom pieces.
00:00:50- Sweet.
00:00:51- We're at around two and a half million revenue a year.
00:00:54We want to be around 10.
00:00:56- How do you sell? - At least.
00:00:57Mostly Google Ads.
00:00:59- So e-commerce?
00:01:00- Yeah, she sells.
00:01:01- Yeah, okay, so invoices, phone calls.
00:01:02Okay, got it.
00:01:03- So how do we increase our leads 2X, 3X
00:01:07without breaking the bank, basically?
00:01:09- How do you increase your lead flow
00:01:11without breaking the bank?
00:01:12- Yeah.
00:01:13- Well, I'll ask you.
00:01:14- For quality leads, basically.
00:01:15- So what are you currently doing?
00:01:17You said Google Ads?
00:01:18- Yeah, around 15 to 20K a month.
00:01:20- Can you spend more?
00:01:21- Yeah. - Why don't we do that?
00:01:23- We've tried and we weren't generating
00:01:26the same quality leads or necessarily getting more.
00:01:28- So there's different keywords.
00:01:29We're not getting you more quality.
00:01:31- Yeah. - Correct.
00:01:32This is probably a scale thing though.
00:01:33Like this is a media buying question
00:01:36because I can promise you that at $20,000 a month,
00:01:38you haven't saturated the market
00:01:39for cool custom gaming stuff.
00:01:42Like you could probably get to like 2 million a month
00:01:44before you even get close to that.
00:01:46So I think it's probably just like,
00:01:48who does your media buying?
00:01:49- We have a company.
00:01:50- Okay, I would, this is a keyword thing.
00:01:53They're like, this is three degrees down,
00:01:56like super tactical.
00:01:56Like we're just buying the wrong words.
00:01:58And there's just, we like,
00:01:59I would be, what's your margins right now?
00:02:01- 20%, 500K a year.
00:02:04- So you just have to see this as like,
00:02:08we might burn $200,000 this year on bad keywords
00:02:12to find another six that we can scale up
00:02:15to $100,000 a month.
00:02:16And by doing that, we'll 5X the business.
00:02:18And so if you just see it like that of like, okay,
00:02:20we're gonna spend 200,000 or $300,000
00:02:23to take us from two point whatever to 10,
00:02:25that's how I think about it.
00:02:27In general, we tend to be like scared to spend more money.
00:02:32And I would say that the only thing
00:02:33that's really shifted for me is like
00:02:34from entrepreneur to investor,
00:02:36like kind of wearing both hats
00:02:37is that I look so much stuff at just like return on capital
00:02:40and like, what's the point?
00:02:41Like if I think we can get to 10,
00:02:43I would rather just get to 10 faster.
00:02:45And I see, because I don't live off of that $500,000 a year,
00:02:49I just see all of that as my fodder
00:02:52for putting back into the thing
00:02:53so that I can get to the next level,
00:02:55which side quest for everyone.
00:02:57If you're a service business and you have cash flow,
00:03:00some businesses are really obvious
00:03:01for where you do reinvestment.
00:03:02If you're brick and mortar, you save up your shackles,
00:03:04you open other location, very clear where your capex is.
00:03:07You're manufacturing, you buy another big machine,
00:03:08very clear where the capex goes, right?
00:03:10If you're a service business, you do accounts,
00:03:12you have a law firm, you got legal people.
00:03:16What do you do with the extra money
00:03:17to quote reinvest in the business?
00:03:18So there's two primary sources.
00:03:20Number one is gonna be talent and culture.
00:03:23So who am I gonna hire and how do I up-level the team?
00:03:27So in service businesses in general,
00:03:29you can see how good you are
00:03:30and how advanced you are as a service provider
00:03:32by the price you're able to charge.
00:03:34And so over time, your price should always go up
00:03:36because fundamentally you should have a virtuous cycle
00:03:38of we do good work, that generates more demand.
00:03:41More demand means more than we have supply,
00:03:43which means we can raise the price.
00:03:44With the extras cash, we can then acquire better talent,
00:03:47which means we do a better job,
00:03:48which increases our reputation, which increases our price,
00:03:51which allows us to charge more
00:03:52so that we can get better talent.
00:03:53And so the talent should always be going up
00:03:55and so should the price.
00:03:57And so if you're in a marketplace where you're like,
00:03:58"Man, we can't charge more than other people,"
00:04:00it's because you aren't better than other people.
00:04:02So we have to beat them in order, like we have to do better.
00:04:05That's point one.
00:04:06The second area is brand, right?
00:04:08It's like, how do I spend some of that extra cash
00:04:10to solidify the brand of me?
00:04:13So this is not direct response ads.
00:04:14This is like kind of the big aspirational moments,
00:04:17these brand moments,
00:04:18like we just did this launch just two weekends ago.
00:04:20It's like, how do I do these big demonstrations
00:04:22that might cost more
00:04:23and might not be the normal run of business?
00:04:25Like why would Red Bull have a guy
00:04:26jump from out of space down?
00:04:28It doesn't make any sense,
00:04:28but except it makes a ton of sense
00:04:30because I'm talking about it right now, right?
00:04:32And so you're probably more likely
00:04:33to drink a Red Bull at the break.
00:04:34Real talk.
00:04:35And so anyways, it's like,
00:04:38how does this ladder back to selling more pool tables?
00:04:41For you though,
00:04:42you're not in a service-based business per se,
00:04:44but I thought it was a good offshoot for other people.
00:04:47See all of the profit that you have,
00:04:49whatever you don't need to live on
00:04:50as your experimentation budget.
00:04:52And that budget is really like,
00:04:54do not see it as I lost money.
00:04:56Like you can't think with that perspective.
00:04:58You will just lose.
00:04:59You have to think of that.
00:05:00This is like, I'm going to rigorously test keywords
00:05:05until I find more keywords that win.
00:05:07And these are just investments
00:05:09in finding money printing machines
00:05:10because keywords, especially once you really find them,
00:05:13they kind of just print for you,
00:05:15which you guys are experiencing right now, right?
00:05:16You guys spend $250,000 a year to make a 2.2, right?
00:05:19You're getting 10 to one on it.
00:05:20Now, obviously you have cost of goods for sure,
00:05:21but like profitable, right?
00:05:24And I'm sure when you found your first keyword
00:05:25and it started working, you were like, holy shit.
00:05:27It's like, great.
00:05:28We just need to find like another hundred.
00:05:29And they're there, they're there.
00:05:31And you might need bridge pages.
00:05:33So you may have heard of Eugene Schwartz.
00:05:37So famous marketer.
00:05:41And so when you really want to scale ads to colder markets,
00:05:44for those of you who went through the hooks
00:05:46and the go-to ads, anyone go through go-to ads playbook?
00:05:49Okay, so this will sound a little bit more familiar.
00:05:52So you have these levels of awareness
00:05:56that correspond with size of market.
00:05:58And so you've got your most aware customers here.
00:06:00And the reason that these levels are important
00:06:03is that it changes what the hook is
00:06:05and what the kind of click journey is for the customer.
00:06:08So at the very top, you've got unaware,
00:06:10then you've got problem aware,
00:06:11you've got solution aware, you've got product aware,
00:06:14and then you've got most aware,
00:06:15which is usually your existing customers, right?
00:06:18And so if you want to expand, so right now,
00:06:21I'll bet you most of your keywords
00:06:22are targeting these people.
00:06:23If you want to go up market,
00:06:25which might have 10 times more clicks,
00:06:27we might have to have a bridge page after you have,
00:06:30like the keyword might be more like home projects
00:06:34or like access, like I'd have to think of that.
00:06:38I'd use a keyword finder.
00:06:39- Would you have like the same team work on that
00:06:42or hire a completely different marketing team to kind of?
00:06:45- A really good media buyer would know this,
00:06:47but you'll likely just need to have keywords
00:06:50that are a little bit broader.
00:06:51So you start competing against more people,
00:06:53but as long as you bring them
00:06:55to kind of like an advertorial type page,
00:06:57and then they take the next step,
00:06:59and then it basically mimics the same path as this.
00:07:01It's like you take them from product aware
00:07:03to then advertorial, then to your sales page,
00:07:06that bridge, the clicks here might also be like
00:07:09one 10th the price and there's an ocean of them.
00:07:11And then when you go from there, it's like, okay,
00:07:13what's above that?
00:07:15Problem aware, is your house boring?
00:07:18Right, like, do you have an extra room
00:07:19that you don't know what to do with?
00:07:20Right, these are problem aware.
00:07:21They have a problem.
00:07:22They have no idea that you're going to sell them a pool table,
00:07:24but we have to start with where they're at
00:07:25and then lead them through the journey.
00:07:27- Thank you, appreciate it.
00:07:28- Real quick, I'm going to show you the exact 10 stage roadmap
00:07:31from zero to a hundred million plus
00:07:34that less than 1% of companies finish.
00:07:36I've now done multiple times.
00:07:37And so I can say with a lot of confidence
00:07:38that these are the stages as headcount increases
00:07:41that you need to get through.
00:07:43And I broke each of these down
00:07:44by eight different functions of the business.
00:07:46What the constraint feels like,
00:07:47like what are the symptoms of it when you're going through it?
00:07:50And then what steps we actually took to graduate.
00:07:52And we've done this across software, physical products,
00:07:55service businesses, brick and mortar, all of this.
00:07:58And it works.
00:07:59And it's my gift to you, it's absolutely free.
00:08:00And so the link's in the description,
00:08:02but you just go acquisition.com/roadmap,
00:08:04just enter your info and it'll spit it right back to you,
00:08:06all free.
00:08:07- My name is Ethan.
00:08:08We sell direct response e-commerce products.
00:08:10We're all paid media.
00:08:12We do about $3 million a year in revenue.
00:08:15- Direct response?
00:08:16- E-commerce products.
00:08:18- Okay.
00:08:19Like drop shipping stuff?
00:08:20- Pretty much, yeah.
00:08:21It's more branded than that, but essentially is.
00:08:23- Yeah, so you have customers who are doing that
00:08:25or you're doing that?
00:08:26- We're doing that.
00:08:27- Okay, got it.
00:08:27And so you have a handful, how many SKUs do you have?
00:08:30- Like four.
00:08:31- Okay.
00:08:32Is it all the same brand?
00:08:33- No.
00:08:34- Okay.
00:08:35- Yep, so we're doing, it's like four months old.
00:08:39So we're doing a run rate of like 3 million a year.
00:08:41We have background in like pay traffic affiliate.
00:08:46So it's not the first way with that.
00:08:47We're trying to get to like 15 million a year run rate.
00:08:50What's stopping us right now, not entirely sure,
00:08:55but basically like we have each step
00:08:57for everything that has to be done.
00:08:59We've built out teams and systems for the main priorities
00:09:03and those things are working pretty well.
00:09:04I'm happy with our talent and what they're producing.
00:09:08But so far, what I'm experiencing is that,
00:09:11I'm left with this list of like random chores
00:09:14that somehow only I can do.
00:09:16- A junk drawer, yeah.
00:09:17- But I'm not sure how to approach hiring for this
00:09:20'cause it ends up being like a very niche specific task,
00:09:23but I made, I might only need them for like,
00:09:2620 minutes a week or something.
00:09:27So it ends up being me, but with a million things.
00:09:30- And you were a founder?
00:09:32- Yeah.
00:09:33- Okay, so let's start here.
00:09:38You wanna get to 15 million.
00:09:39What stops you from spending more money?
00:09:42- Nothing right now.
00:09:43I mean, so we just hired a pretty robust funnel team
00:09:46and an operations guy, like a strategist.
00:09:48So kind of just waiting on those things to kick in really,
00:09:52but I'm fairly confident at least do it.
00:09:54- Okay, so this is more a complaint than a constraint, right?
00:10:01No, I'm just being, this is me asking for clarity.
00:10:03So we think we can double if we just spend more money.
00:10:07I'm not spending more money
00:10:08because I'm waiting for this thing to happen.
00:10:11Once this thing happens,
00:10:12then I'm gonna spend as much money as I can, right?
00:10:15And in the meantime, I have stuff I don't feel like doing.
00:10:20No, I'm like, this is me trying to translate back.
00:10:22Is that true?
00:10:23Is that like accurate?
00:10:24- Yeah, but eventually there's gonna be enough of that stuff
00:10:25that like I will have to find some way
00:10:27to hire out for these things.
00:10:29- Yeah, and then there'll be more stuff
00:10:30that you'll still do.
00:10:32You'll just do the more important, valuable stuff
00:10:34and give the other stuff to somebody else.
00:10:36- Yeah, but a lot of it ends up being fairly tedious.
00:10:39Like it doesn't feel like high leverage
00:10:41or high value at all.
00:10:42- I mean, this is where like VA's and project work
00:10:45can come really in handy.
00:10:46Like I'll give you an example.
00:10:48So when we made all the ads for the launch, right?
00:10:51I don't, I didn't need the amount of editors
00:10:54that I had to spin up in order to,
00:10:57'cause like I'm not gonna be making 300 ads a week ongoing.
00:11:01I don't need to, but for the launch I did,
00:11:03and I wasn't gonna hire an extra 15 editors full-time
00:11:07'cause it's just like, I don't need that.
00:11:09And so we spun up 15 editors that were contractors
00:11:12who would then just clip.
00:11:13And we had one person just did QA on it
00:11:15to make sure that it was good.
00:11:16And then we'd ship them, right?
00:11:18And so if we have something that's like one time-ish work
00:11:20where it's sporadic, then I'm fine just having a suite
00:11:24or a bench of contractors that I can turn on and off.
00:11:27- Sure.
00:11:28- As long as they do decent work.
00:11:29- We do similar things like with our video editors as well,
00:11:33but you know, some of the tasks are fairly specialized.
00:11:36- No, I understand.
00:11:36I was just using an example for editors,
00:11:38but I'm saying like, if you have tedious work,
00:11:40like this is where the fibers of the world
00:11:42like can come in handy.
00:11:44And worst case you train a contractor or VA on how to do it.
00:11:47And then they do it.
00:11:48- Yeah.
00:11:49Just like someone that's high level enough
00:11:51and like Shopify work, but we only use them for a few hours.
00:11:53- There's tons of Shopify contractors,
00:11:55like a boatload of them.
00:11:56- Yeah.
00:11:57- And they're not that expensive.
00:11:58And some of them are really good.
00:11:59Yeah, like I would just look at my list.
00:12:01What are the things that I'm doing on a regular basis?
00:12:03Can I ship out most of these to a contractor
00:12:05does a piecemeal probably.
00:12:07And now you're trading 20 hours for two
00:12:09and that's just, you just keep making that trade
00:12:11until eventually you've managing a ton of people.
00:12:12And then it's like, great,
00:12:13one person is managing all of these
00:12:14and you just trade all that time for you getting more
00:12:16because hopefully if you're doing that much work,
00:12:18then you should have the revenue support that role.
00:12:21Have you scaled e-commerce like this before?
00:12:25- Yeah.
00:12:25- Okay, are you just running paid ads?
00:12:30- Yes.
00:12:31- Okay, do you have influencers who are doing stuff?
00:12:33- No influencers, we were looking to hire for that,
00:12:36but we have three or four channels for paid at least.
00:12:39- Yeah, I'll say this.
00:12:41How big do you want this debate?
00:12:43- I mean, ultimately like the goal
00:12:45is we'd like to have a portfolio
00:12:46of call it four or five brands
00:12:48that we can then exit in a couple of years.
00:12:51- So I have this conversation every week
00:12:54with somebody who's doing e-commerce
00:12:57and it's almost always the same.
00:12:58Like I would like to have a portfolio
00:13:00of a handful of products
00:13:01that I could eventually sell someday.
00:13:03I have really yet to see anyone do that.
00:13:05And it's, I think for two reasons.
00:13:08One is that as you continue to scale,
00:13:11your CAC will continue to go up
00:13:14and your gross margins will shrink
00:13:16and that will get frustrating.
00:13:18You will then also have supply chain issues,
00:13:19which would become a burden.
00:13:21You also have dupes.
00:13:22If you start becoming really good,
00:13:23that will undercut you in price
00:13:25and list on Amazon and all that stuff.
00:13:28Do you have patent protected
00:13:29like for any of these products?
00:13:31And so like you right now run a media arbitrage business
00:13:34and it works really well up to about 10 million.
00:13:37And then it will quickly stop working very well.
00:13:41And so I think to your point of like,
00:13:42you can see a double, that's probably true.
00:13:44You might even triple that's sitting there
00:13:46with little optimization, more email followup,
00:13:48blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
00:13:49But you'll probably get close to capping
00:13:52in that neighborhood, 10, maybe 12.
00:13:54And then you're gonna be like,
00:13:56well, we're doing a million dollars a month,
00:13:57but we have like almost no margin
00:13:59and our cashflow is fucked.
00:14:01And so what I think you want is that you want to build a brand
00:14:06that has a product that you really believe in
00:14:10that will allow you to recruit affiliates to your cause.
00:14:14When I say affiliates, I mean, influencers,
00:14:16not traditional direct response affiliates
00:14:18that are just mercenaries,
00:14:19but like people actually believe in it.
00:14:22And when you do that,
00:14:23you will actually be able to build a brand
00:14:25because fundamentally like any one of the products
00:14:27can be big enough on their own to sell.
00:14:30And so rather than saying like,
00:14:32why don't we try and build four totally different products
00:14:35and totally different brands at the same time?
00:14:37It's like, why don't we just try to build one
00:14:39that we really like that we think has a chance
00:14:41at actually like really helping people
00:14:44for whatever the problem that the product solves.
00:14:47That's what will build what I think you want.
00:14:49It's just that most people come from the direct response world
00:14:52just are pure performance marketers.
00:14:54And I say this being someone who comes from that world.
00:14:57And I had to learn the hard way that
00:14:59you will run into the wall that,
00:15:02there's a great article you can recall
00:15:03the direct response doom loop, which you might've read.
00:15:06But basically you just do this revenue goes up,
00:15:09margins compressed, margins compressed
00:15:10until you're eventually here.
00:15:11And then you have to keep selling
00:15:11in order to maintain your team.
00:15:12And then you just run a very large,
00:15:13very high high liability nonprofit and it sucks.
00:15:17And cashflow is a huge constraint
00:15:18and you've got all the supply chain bullshit.
00:15:20And then you're like, this sucks.
00:15:22And then you'd have another conversation, come back here.
00:15:24We're like, Hey, we're doing 12 million with 7% margins.
00:15:27And I would say, okay, of the four products you have,
00:15:29which one is the one that's the clear winner?
00:15:31That's the one that's carrying all the other losers.
00:15:33And you'd be like, well, it's this one.
00:15:33And then I'd say, okay, cool.
00:15:34Why don't we just get rid of these three
00:15:36and then put all of your effort on this?
00:15:37Do you think you'd be able to win that way?
00:15:38You'd be like, Oh my God, sure.
00:15:39And be like, great.
00:15:40So like, why don't we do that?
00:15:41And then actually invest in building the brand around it.
00:15:44- We definitely have,
00:15:47we're paid traffic affiliates.
00:15:49So like we're data people.
00:15:51But so one of the things that I've thought about is like,
00:15:54our biggest skew, it's good, but it's not like,
00:15:56it's not that good.
00:15:57Like I know a good campaign when I see it.
00:15:59So like part of the purpose of building out,
00:16:01like in our research and funnel teams is like,
00:16:04well, eventually we're gonna find something
00:16:05where the market is just like 10 times better.
00:16:08So it's like, do we keep chugging along with like the one
00:16:11that's like a six out of 10 or do we go find the nine
00:16:13and then go on on that?
00:16:14- The skillset that you guys are deficient in
00:16:17is going to be brand.
00:16:19And that's what you have to learn how to do.
00:16:21And the brand is also completed with the product.
00:16:24So like that's what completes the brand loop.
00:16:25Like we make this amazing promise.
00:16:27We have all these great associations.
00:16:28People then make the purchase and then the product
00:16:30either reinforces the brand or destroys the brand.
00:16:33And if it reinforces the brand,
00:16:34then the loop continues and becomes a virtuous cycle.
00:16:36And that's how you go from an e-commerce store
00:16:38that does media arbitrage into a household name
00:16:41that you can sell for not just 50 million,
00:16:43but maybe 500 million.
00:16:45And so it's just that like I have this conversation
00:16:47literally every week.
00:16:49And so I know that you're coming at this
00:16:52from a math perspective.
00:16:53It's just that it will not work at scale.
00:16:55And so I would rather you spend as little as you can
00:16:58on all of these different things to find a product
00:17:01that you guys really think is legit
00:17:03and has some level of defensibility if you can,
00:17:05because if you don't have a defensible product,
00:17:07the only thing that you have is the brand
00:17:08to differentiate you.
00:17:09That's the only differentiator.
00:17:11And so if you're competing, 'cause like,
00:17:13just play it out the next step, right?
00:17:14Like let's say you find your nine out of 10.
00:17:17No one's buying that.
00:17:18Like private equity investor, not buying it
00:17:20because they know the game.
00:17:21They buy brands.
00:17:22They don't buy products.
00:17:23And so you get your nine out of 10 and then the dupes flood
00:17:26because they see that you're killing it.
00:17:28And then they undercut you on all this stuff.
00:17:29And then your ROAS goes down
00:17:30and then you leak everything to your competitors.
00:17:33So either you have some sort of patent
00:17:35that you can actually protect
00:17:35and you have a legal team that can enforce it,
00:17:37or you build a brand.
00:17:40So like, that's the long-term play.
00:17:42The rest of this is just making money
00:17:44until you figure that out.
00:17:45I'm being super real with you.
00:17:47I'd just rather save you a couple of years.
00:17:49But like that is where this leads.
00:17:50- Okay.
00:17:51I mean, so-
00:17:52- How do you build a brand?
00:17:54- Yeah, right.
00:17:54(laughing)
00:17:55Yeah, how do I do that?
00:17:56But you know, we are working on like
00:17:58the legal defensibility of it.
00:17:59You know, I didn't mean to say like-
00:18:01- I would lead with brand rather than legal.
00:18:03I would lead with brand rather than legal.
00:18:05Because legal, you have to like, it's still tough to like,
00:18:10it's better to be big and then win with legal
00:18:12than try and be small and win with legal
00:18:13because you'll just get drowned in fees.
00:18:15And it's better to just have the coolest brand
00:18:18and have the coolest people promoting the thing.
00:18:21And then people just want to buy from you,
00:18:22even though they see the cheaper knockoffs.
00:18:24But that's like, that's what you have to do.
00:18:26If you really want to go where you want to go,
00:18:27otherwise you're just going to be cycling through SKUs
00:18:30and you're going to say you have a portfolio
00:18:31and it'll sound impressive to people
00:18:32who don't know what you're talking about.
00:18:34But like, margins will do this, cash flow will get fucked,
00:18:37and you have co-founders and it'll be like,
00:18:39this is so much work, this sucks.
00:18:42I wish we just had one product
00:18:43that we all really believed in
00:18:44that we could like build a business around.
00:18:46And that's what you want to do.
00:18:47- Thank you.
00:18:48- Yeah, you bet.
00:18:49- Hi, my name is Samantha Harrison.
00:18:51I own a hair extension company in Australia.
00:18:54- Amazing.
00:18:55- I have a salon and an e-commerce business.
00:18:58- A what in e-commerce?
00:19:00- Sorry, sorry, I wholesale.
00:19:02- Wholesale and e-commerce.
00:19:03So direct to consumer and wholesale.
00:19:04- Yeah.
00:19:05- Okay, got it.
00:19:06- Sorry, I'm like so nervous.
00:19:08I have a terrible fear of public speaking.
00:19:10- Have a panic attack and then just ask the question.
00:19:12You're good.
00:19:13(audience laughing)
00:19:14- I forgot what my question was.
00:19:16- Fine.
00:19:17We can pick another one.
00:19:18- I'm just gonna read what I wrote down, if that's okay.
00:19:19(laughing)
00:19:21Okay.
00:19:22So to make either business truly sellable at high valuation,
00:19:26it would take me years of operational restructuring,
00:19:30recruitment, reducing owner dependence and building systems.
00:19:33And even then the multiple would be low
00:19:36because service-based product businesses
00:19:38don't scale without heavy ongoing input.
00:19:40I want to move into SaaS.
00:19:44- You think this is hard?
00:19:47And so you're like, you know what I could do?
00:19:49Something harder.
00:19:50(laughing)
00:19:51- And so I guess that was the point of me
00:19:53coming to this seminar.
00:19:55'Cause I know you talk a lot about
00:19:56like the women in the red dress.
00:19:58- Yeah, or men in the tuxedo, you know, whatever works.
00:20:01(laughing)
00:20:03- Obviously I'm fearful 'cause it's not my niche
00:20:07and it's not what I specialize in.
00:20:09But I obviously being in the industry,
00:20:12I definitely see a lack in the market and educating.
00:20:16- So what is the SaaS that you're trying to build?
00:20:17Or that you wouldn't wanna build?
00:20:18- So it's an online booking system for,
00:20:20well, the niche is for salons,
00:20:21but it can be used for service-based businesses.
00:20:23- There's so many of those.
00:20:24- It's got AI built into it.
00:20:26And the difference between mine and say everybody else's
00:20:32is it's essentially bridging the gap
00:20:34between revenue and profit.
00:20:36So giving like more of like a pool data rather than push.
00:20:40Having the AI built in as more as like
00:20:44a motivational business coach,
00:20:46which will give you the real time analytics on your team,
00:20:49on your services, on your numbers, on your margins,
00:20:51like everything like that.
00:20:52Like for me personally, I spend every week
00:20:55calculating every single team members revenue,
00:20:58cost of product.
00:20:59- Do you own a salon too?
00:20:59- Yeah.
00:21:00- Okay.
00:21:01- Yeah, so the salon and the wholesale run without me.
00:21:04- Okay, passive.
00:21:05- The salon does about,
00:21:07so the salon does about say 900,000 with 50% margin.
00:21:11And I'm happy with like what,
00:21:13like I don't really wanna scale the salon.
00:21:15The wholesale year or this year has grown 100%,
00:21:19but it's about 30% month on month.
00:21:20- What was the revenue of the wholesale?
00:21:23- Think I'm just at 2.6 so far.
00:21:26- And you have 30% margins on that?
00:21:28- Yeah.
00:21:28- Great.
00:21:29- So the financial overview for this SaaS,
00:21:34so it's $500,000 build, 120 grand a year to maintain,
00:21:39but it's serving my same audience, right?
00:21:42The stockists are already salon owners.
00:21:44They already buy from me.
00:21:45They already trust me.
00:21:46It's something that they won't use,
00:21:48have already subscribed to like the founders.
00:21:51Don't look at me like that.
00:21:52(audience laughing)
00:21:53Believe in me.
00:21:54(audience laughing)
00:21:56- I do, I do.
00:21:59- I'm just trying to figure out which you to believe in.
00:22:01- I'd only need 150 subscribers to maintain costs,
00:22:05which I've already got.
00:22:07So if I had 2000 of my weekly stockists
00:22:12that already buy from me, subscribe this to me in a year,
00:22:15it's fine, right?
00:22:17Tell me it's a good idea, please.
00:22:18(audience laughing)
00:22:21- So much pain.
00:22:21(audience laughing)
00:22:22- You sound like Ed.
00:22:24(audience laughing)
00:22:26I've been sulking all day.
00:22:29So one of the difficulties that I have,
00:22:30like this is a perfect scenario of telling someone
00:22:34what they want to hear versus telling them what I think.
00:22:36And I'm always, it's a very fine line
00:22:38because like I always want everyone to leave happy.
00:22:41But I also feel like I have integrity tough, right?
00:22:44And so what I will do is I'll give you a sorting question
00:22:50and you can pick what side you want.
00:22:52I can assume your position
00:22:54and then tell you what I would do,
00:22:56although I disagree with it,
00:22:57or I can tell you what I think you should do.
00:22:59- Okay.
00:23:00- Which one would you like?
00:23:01- Tell me what I should do.
00:23:02- Okay, great.
00:23:03I think that--
00:23:06- I'm going.
00:23:07(laughing)
00:23:09- I think you getting into SaaS
00:23:10as somebody who has never built a software product
00:23:13and doing it where you're going to self fund it.
00:23:15And just because you have a distribution base
00:23:19does not mean that you should sell every single thing
00:23:21that that distribution base can buy.
00:23:23- What if I've already paid for it?
00:23:25- That's called sunk cost fallacy.
00:23:27(laughing)
00:23:27- True.
00:23:28- So I just give up, I don't try?
00:23:29- Yeah.
00:23:30Some of the best money you ever spend
00:23:31is deciding to stop spending bad money.
00:23:32- Okay.
00:23:33- And I say this only having done it myself.
00:23:37So I'm gonna hit from a couple angles.
00:23:41So the first one is who here is organic
00:23:43as their primary method of getting customers,
00:23:45like making content, et cetera.
00:23:46And it gets bigger and bigger every time.
00:23:48It's just the way the world's moving.
00:23:51So one of the big mistakes
00:23:53that people who have organic audiences make
00:23:55is that you grow an audience
00:23:56and then you sell a product.
00:23:57And then people buy the product and you make money.
00:23:59And that's a very reinforcing event.
00:24:00And so then, but they already bought the product.
00:24:02So then you think, well shit, I should make another product.
00:24:04And so you make another product.
00:24:05And then within two or three years,
00:24:07all of a sudden you have four mini businesses
00:24:09that serve the same pool of customers.
00:24:10When the real constraint of the business
00:24:11is you needed to grow your audience.
00:24:13And so the invisible beauty, sorry, not extensions,
00:24:16whatever it is that you sell, right?
00:24:18The hair extensions that you sell,
00:24:21you're doing 2.6.
00:24:22Then what's the e-commerce side doing in revenue?
00:24:25- Yeah, it's like 900.
00:24:26- 900, that's what it's doing.
00:24:27- Sorry, sorry, the salon is 900, the online is 2.6.
00:24:32- So, okay.
00:24:33So there is no, you said e-commerce at some point.
00:24:35- Yeah, sorry.
00:24:35E-commerce, I'm selling hair extensions online.
00:24:37- Is the wholesaling.
00:24:38- Yes. - Okay, got it.
00:24:39It's B2B on that side.
00:24:40- But I also sell to retail, wholesale and retail.
00:24:42So anyone can buy, but I do have stockists.
00:24:44- The vast majority is other stylists buying, right?
00:24:48- So Layla can buy from me,
00:24:50but also hair extension salon owners
00:24:52can register for a trade account.
00:24:54- And how many of the sales are trade accounts?
00:24:56- It's about 50%.
00:24:57- It is, interesting, okay.
00:24:59So anyways, back to this point,
00:25:01which is that that business is not sellable.
00:25:04I just wanna be like, you said like, ready started.
00:25:06You're like, it's not sellable, it's operational.
00:25:08It's like, that's, I mean, not necessarily true,
00:25:10kind of at all.
00:25:11You just need to get more customers.
00:25:14And extensions are a reoccurring product.
00:25:17Like people buy them every eight, 16, whatever the weeks are,
00:25:19you know, whatever the, you know it better than I do.
00:25:21But I know I've seen the bill, so.
00:25:25It's not one time.
00:25:26I'm sure about that.
00:25:29So, all that to say, like, all we have to do is just like,
00:25:33you have now encountered the big hairy problem
00:25:35that I talked about at the beginning of today,
00:25:37which is that you encountered something
00:25:38that you didn't know how to solve and then are thinking,
00:25:40okay, well, there's greener pasture over here.
00:25:42There's a girl in a redder dress.
00:25:44And if I go here, surely this grass
00:25:45will not be fertilized with shit.
00:25:47But it is indeed full of shit and significantly more shit
00:25:50than what your current business is.
00:25:51The current business is actually way more chill
00:25:53than the business that you're trying to get into.
00:25:55And the business you currently have
00:25:56is way more cashflow positive
00:25:57than the one you want to get into.
00:25:58The business that you want to get into,
00:26:00you will not make money from for many years
00:26:02if you ever make money from it.
00:26:03So if you want to win at software,
00:26:05you have to commit to making no money
00:26:06for basically seven years.
00:26:08Zero.
00:26:09And the people you're competing against
00:26:10don't have two other businesses.
00:26:11- I guess like my limiting belief around like,
00:26:14I've got a very lean business.
00:26:15So I build a property a couple of years ago.
00:26:18I ended up moving out and I run the wholesale
00:26:20and the salon from that house.
00:26:21And my expense for this salon
00:26:23and the wholesale is 500 bucks a week.
00:26:26So it's very lean.
00:26:28So I think for me-
00:26:28- So you're good at running that business.
00:26:30- Yeah.
00:26:31- You should do something totally different.
00:26:32- But like the idea for me to scale,
00:26:33I'm like, I'd need to increase my pricing
00:26:36and I'd need to obviously move into-
00:26:38- On the extension side you mean?
00:26:39- Yeah.
00:26:40Like my margins are too small for me to be able to scale
00:26:42at the margin set.
00:26:43- So why don't we just do that?
00:26:45Because you thought starting a software company would be easy?
00:26:49- Well, I thought that having like a risk, sorry,
00:26:52a reoccurring.
00:26:53- You do have a reoccurring business.
00:26:54- A subscription based product that I would use as well.
00:26:59- So reoccurring and recurring, right?
00:27:02Have the same value.
00:27:04What we need to demonstrate is revenue retention.
00:27:06- I would just like to make money online while I sleep
00:27:08and I don't want to work anymore.
00:27:09- That's fine.
00:27:10Software companies is certainly not the way to do it.
00:27:12(laughing)
00:27:14Probably the worst way to try and do that.
00:27:16- Okay.
00:27:17- Like we just need to confront the business
00:27:19that you have right now.
00:27:20You need to improve the margins
00:27:21and you need to go get more acquisition.
00:27:23So that probably means like making more content,
00:27:25running ads to attract a stylist,
00:27:27having some sort of offset front end to get them integrated.
00:27:30How can you run some sort of play within their salons?
00:27:34Trying to use your vernacular.
00:27:37To basically make them more money using your extensions.
00:27:41And then by doing that, then they get converted
00:27:43because they make more money selling extensions
00:27:44than cut and color.
00:27:45And so it's very likely they'll keep selling it.
00:27:47And then you have basically, you have a hunter and a farmer.
00:27:49The hunter is the one that basically closes the deal
00:27:51and gets them to kind of activate their base of ladies,
00:27:56I guess, maybe there's hot guy.
00:27:57- It's just like the constraint of the wholesale
00:27:59is the production time and the capital.
00:28:03And again, like my logic was,
00:28:06well, if I was to invest the same $500,000 into the wholesale,
00:28:09that's a $150,000 margin.
00:28:12Whereas I thought, well, if I invested it into subscription.
00:28:16You'd just lose all of it.
00:28:17(audience laughing)
00:28:18- Maybe that's your limiting belief.
00:28:20(audience laughing)
00:28:23- I've built more software companies
00:28:24to a billion than you have.
00:28:26(audience laughing)
00:28:28- Okay, okay.
00:28:30- All right, so you can play that game.
00:28:32(audience laughing)
00:28:33- Okay.
00:28:35- Do you want my help?
00:28:36- Yes.
00:28:37- Take my advice.
00:28:37- Okay.
00:28:38- Cool.
00:28:39- I should do it.
00:28:40No, I'm joking.
00:28:41(audience laughing)
00:28:42- Thank you Amanda.
00:28:42- My name is Sasha.
00:28:44I sell designer bags and sunglasses.
00:28:47- Cool.
00:28:47- And we do about six million a month.
00:28:49No, sorry, a year, sorry.
00:28:50Six million a year.
00:28:51- Still cool.
00:28:53- And I would like to do 38 million.
00:28:57- Precise.
00:28:57- Yeah, 38 million.
00:28:59- Okay.
00:29:00- And what's stopping me is--
00:29:01- Why 38?
00:29:02- Just because I figured, 100,000 a day,
00:29:07something like that.
00:29:08Round up, down, something like that.
00:29:09- Okay.
00:29:10Got it.
00:29:11- Just a roundabout.
00:29:12And I mean, obviously more.
00:29:15- Yeah, yeah, okay.
00:29:16- But I was thinking 38 would be fair.
00:29:18- Yeah, that works.
00:29:19(audience laughing)
00:29:21- And it is just recruiting.
00:29:22- Recruiting is the bottleneck as you're saying.
00:29:25- Yeah.
00:29:26- Okay, got it.
00:29:27- My house cleaner was my first employee
00:29:30and she just, and because I consumed yours
00:29:32and Layla's content so much that I was like,
00:29:35I'm gonna be these two people in one.
00:29:37That's me.
00:29:38I'm gonna be these two people.
00:29:39And as a result, I have a great team.
00:29:43- Okay.
00:29:44- A really great team.
00:29:45And it's just a matter of being militant
00:29:47in the recruiting process.
00:29:49- Okay.
00:29:50- We do sell on whatnot quite a bit.
00:29:54- So who do you have what's stopping you?
00:29:55So you make money, $6 million a year selling handbags.
00:30:01- And sunglasses.
00:30:02- And sunglasses.
00:30:03For you to sell more handbags and sunglasses,
00:30:05you need more people to do that?
00:30:07- Yes, because we only go live for about five hours a day
00:30:10because we get tired.
00:30:12It's just me.
00:30:13Well, me and, I have three salespeople,
00:30:17but it's just we get tired.
00:30:20If we were live more often, we could create more.
00:30:22- You're going live on like your Instagram page or your what?
00:30:26- On whatnot.
00:30:27- Okay, got it.
00:30:28And do you have like a big following there?
00:30:30- 110,000.
00:30:31- And so you're just selling to that same base.
00:30:33And if you just sold for longer, you would make more.
00:30:36- A lot more.
00:30:37$200,000 in the show.
00:30:38- Okay.
00:30:39So you just need like two more salespeople
00:30:41who are going on camera?
00:30:42- But yeah.
00:30:44And then the recruiting as well.
00:30:46- Recruiting for what?
00:30:47- Packing, 'cause we do a lot of--
00:30:50- You do your own 3PL or not third party,
00:30:52but like you do your own logistics?
00:30:53Why?
00:30:56- Why do we do it ourselves?
00:30:58I didn't know you can have other people do it.
00:31:01- Boy, oh boy.
00:31:03Yeah.
00:31:03(all laughing)
00:31:07Step inside.
00:31:08Yes.
00:31:09So functionally like,
00:31:11because of the nature of the business that you're in,
00:31:14we have to think like,
00:31:14'cause we have to consolidate resources.
00:31:16I'm not normally somebody who's like,
00:31:18let's cut parts of the business out.
00:31:20But unless your shipping is some key differentiator
00:31:24that you have,
00:31:25like Amazon shipping became a competitive advantage, right?
00:31:30But unless that's like some differentiator,
00:31:32then shipping for the most part is pretty commoditized.
00:31:35And there are people who all day long,
00:31:37they think about like saving 15 cents on cardboard boxes
00:31:40and tape and packing peanuts and all that shit.
00:31:43And I think that you having to like,
00:31:47think about that and run a functionally a warehouse
00:31:51at the same time as running a marketing and sales
00:31:53and talent business slash media,
00:31:55that's not where the value is.
00:31:57The value's in the distribution and the sales.
00:31:59And so I would say like, can we outsource this so that,
00:32:05can we outsource this, the logistics part?
00:32:08So that you can just go all in.
00:32:10'Cause all we had to do is you get two more salespeople
00:32:12and you get 200,000 a day.
00:32:14We should do that.
00:32:15- So we have to physically show the product.
00:32:20Like literally-- - No, I'm not saying
00:32:21you don't have like some product on hand.
00:32:24You just don't need a warehouse.
00:32:26- No, we do need it.
00:32:27'Cause it's like, go, go, go, go.
00:32:31- Okay. - That's the speed.
00:32:31We run probably about--
00:32:33- So you're like, we sold this item to this person
00:32:36is how you do it.
00:32:36- Yes. - Okay, got it.
00:32:39- And it is kind of like a warehouse.
00:32:41- Okay, that's fine.
00:32:43All right, so you just need to hire more people.
00:32:45So what's stopping you from hiring more people?
00:32:47- The talent.
00:32:48- The talent to hire more people?
00:32:50- Well, I'm learning now, that's why I'm here.
00:32:52- No, no, you're good, you're good.
00:32:54So I'm saying like, you have two sets of roles.
00:32:56You've got warehouse folks
00:32:57and you've got people who can get on camera, right?
00:33:00So what are you currently doing
00:33:02so you get each of those people?
00:33:04- Well, we have ads on Indeed.
00:33:06- Okay.
00:33:07- But I didn't realize how militant it had to be
00:33:08until I came here.
00:33:09It makes a lot of sense, right?
00:33:12I didn't know that there's that many interviews
00:33:14that are required.
00:33:15- And that's more for the warehouse side, correct?
00:33:19- Both, because sales is--
00:33:21- I think that you'd be able to find salespeople,
00:33:24like I would probably look at Amazon affiliates.
00:33:28- How much would you pay them?
00:33:30- Percentage.
00:33:31- Well, that's the thing.
00:33:33So, okay, so it takes skill to do what we do.
00:33:35- Yeah.
00:33:36- It takes skill.
00:33:37- Agreed.
00:33:38- Like, for example, my girl is better than me.
00:33:42- Great.
00:33:43- She's better than me.
00:33:44And it's like, not only is it motor skills,
00:33:48it's presentation and entertainment.
00:33:52- I get it.
00:33:53I understand.
00:33:56I did a live for three days.
00:33:58I got it.
00:33:58Yeah.
00:34:01- So finding and training that,
00:34:04that's definitely a process and takes time.
00:34:06- Yeah.
00:34:07The question is whether you want to buy or build.
00:34:09Do you want to buy the talent or build the talent?
00:34:11Building the talent is cheaper, takes longer, harder.
00:34:13Buying the talent is faster, more expensive.
00:34:16Which one feels right for you?
00:34:18- So when it comes to the,
00:34:22so we have, we're not always,
00:34:25so we are profitable per show, yes.
00:34:28- Okay.
00:34:29- Profitable per show.
00:34:30- But sometimes what ends up happening is like,
00:34:33let's just say it's a Wednesday.
00:34:35- Are you on cash-based accounting or accrual?
00:34:38Probably cash.
00:34:39- Yeah.
00:34:39- So you might like, if basically,
00:34:41if you were in a physical products business,
00:34:43which you do here, you're like, okay, we made money.
00:34:49Now let's take all of that profit, gross profit that we had
00:34:51and go buy more shit so we can sell more shit, right?
00:34:54Right, so this is where like, you probably have,
00:34:57what's your, like, what's your financial,
00:34:59the financial side of the business, the financial ops
00:35:00look like?
00:35:01- My accountant handles it.
00:35:04- Your who?
00:35:05- My accountant.
00:35:05- Oh, your accountant does it, okay.
00:35:06- Yeah.
00:35:08- You will need to have, soon,
00:35:11a relatively strong finance person
00:35:13who can give you better forecasting so that you can,
00:35:15it's not just like, how much cash do we have in bank account,
00:35:17let's go buy more shit.
00:35:18It's like, we can only afford to buy this much,
00:35:20given this growth rate that we want to have.
00:35:23Otherwise you will get into these probably cash crunches
00:35:25that you're feeling right now.
00:35:26It's not that the business isn't profitable,
00:35:28'cause I'm guessing the headcount's not super buy.
00:35:31- So our shows will make anywhere
00:35:34from like five to 7,000 in profit,
00:35:36depending on the volume that we did that day.
00:35:38So we know the profit per show, however,
00:35:41that's where the skill comes into play.
00:35:44Like if a show's not going well,
00:35:45we need to have that person trained
00:35:47to be able to do the thing.
00:35:49And so that's why not knowing how much to pay them
00:35:52is the concern.
00:35:53- Well, I mean, I think doing a percentage would make sense.
00:35:56- Percentage of profit.
00:35:57- Yeah, like a salesperson.
00:35:59- Okay.
00:36:00- And so you can buy or build that, right?
00:36:02So you buy it as I would just go to mini micro influencers
00:36:05who are already like on Amazon hawking stuff and be like,
00:36:08well, they already do live streams
00:36:09and they already do sell shit.
00:36:11And I bet I could teach them to do this for me.
00:36:13That is a buy version.
00:36:14'Cause you already know it's already proven.
00:36:16You're just saying, hey, do it under my umbrella.
00:36:17The build version is that you have to kiss a lot more toads
00:36:20and try and look for who has already built in
00:36:24a bunch of soft skills.
00:36:26And then you can hire for the smallest skill deficiency
00:36:31that you know how to train.
00:36:32- Okay, so Amazon affiliates.
00:36:34- Well, you can do either, but like, yeah, I mean,
00:36:35obviously this is gonna be a lower risk thing.
00:36:36And then you just have to have some agreement
00:36:38that they're gonna only sell for you for X period of time.
00:36:41- Like a contract.
00:36:41- Like a contract.
00:36:43- Thank you.
00:36:44- Yes, but I would, but big picture,
00:36:45'cause I wanna make sure that you're good.
00:36:48The Indeed warehouse stuff, that's just like commoditized.
00:36:50I mean, you have a warehouse,
00:36:51maybe you have to have it for your business,
00:36:53but like, I don't see that as like,
00:36:54that's not a core differentiator.
00:36:56You might, you're not different
00:36:57because you have a warehouse behind you.
00:36:59That's not special.
00:37:00So the roles that you have there, it's like,
00:37:02they need to be like, have a pulse, have a good leader there.
00:37:05Let them just deal with it.
00:37:06Your star factor is gonna be your ability
00:37:10to train people to sell.
00:37:12And so that's like, where's your, what is like,
00:37:15what is the true pinpoint of where the most value
00:37:17gets created for you as the founder, the entrepreneur,
00:37:20is that you need to be able to take somebody
00:37:21and teach them to sell.
00:37:23- I, yeah, my.
00:37:26And you have to break it down in terms
00:37:28of the most concrete language you possibly can.
00:37:32And so think of everything purely in terms of behavior
00:37:35and do not use any amorphous words.
00:37:38So it's like, I need you to have higher energy.
00:37:40That means nothing.
00:37:41I need you to raise your voice.
00:37:43I need you to talk faster.
00:37:44I need you to have your shoulders back.
00:37:46You have to describe things that people can see.
00:37:48And then other people describe them as having high energy,
00:37:50having charisma, having confidence.
00:37:52And so if you wanna teach someone to present,
00:37:55you have to tell them what to do with their body
00:37:57and their voice, and it will be far faster for you.
00:38:00And what you'll find is the training lab,
00:38:02the reason it takes so long for people to train
00:38:04or they can, or they can't train salespeople
00:38:06or presentation people is because they literally
00:38:08do not use words that other people understand.
00:38:11Like this is the problem.
00:38:12This is why most companies cannot teach people to do shit.
00:38:15Because they say, have more charisma,
00:38:17and then the person listens and is like,
00:38:19I'll translate that into what I think charisma means,
00:38:21which who fucking knows what they think it means, right?
00:38:24And then we're just playing this telephone game
00:38:25where no one agreed on what are the behaviors
00:38:27I want you to do.
00:38:29That will compress the amount of time
00:38:31that will take you to get someone up to speed.
00:38:33And two, long-term, if you can develop the sales training,
00:38:36then you can have a stable of stallions
00:38:38that are on 24/7 for you working in your barn.
00:38:42- So that--
00:38:43- I don't know why it's animals now, but let's go with it.
00:38:45- So that's actually, that brings up a good point.
00:38:48So I have, so my girl, like I said,
00:38:52she's my house cleaner, shows up at my door one day.
00:38:54She's like, hey, I want to be you.
00:38:58And she's like, I'm a copy and paste of you.
00:39:00And she became me.
00:39:01Now there's a little bit, like a little bit of a,
00:39:05how can I, 'cause obviously I had to learn to care apart,
00:39:08like from Laila.
00:39:09So I learned to care apart and now I have it.
00:39:15But then I've seen her, I mean,
00:39:17I've seen situations kind of like not go the way they should
00:39:21because she's too, she's a copy and paste of me
00:39:24from yesterday.
00:39:26So I'm starting to see those kind of--
00:39:28- What's the problem?
00:39:29We'll just put her in front of the camera,
00:39:33have her sell and get her out of the building.
00:39:35It's like, she can sell.
00:39:37- Yeah.
00:39:38- So let her sell.
00:39:38Don't have her manage people, have her sell.
00:39:40- Got it.
00:39:41Understood, thank you.
00:39:42- Okay.
00:39:43(laughing)
00:39:44This is good talk, yeah.
00:39:44- Okay, thank you.
00:39:46- Real quick, I have a gift for you.
00:39:48This is the $100 million scaling roadmap.
00:39:50It's something that my team and I put 200 plus hours
00:39:52into building and breaking the stages of scaling
00:39:55into 10 steps.
00:39:56All right, and so what we did is we broke down everything
00:39:58that basically got us stuck and what we did to break free
00:40:01at each level of the business.
00:40:03And if you'd like to know what product, marketing, sales,
00:40:05customer service, IT, recruiting, human resources,
00:40:08and finance look like at the stage that you're currently at,
00:40:11this is a free gift.
00:40:12So all you have to do is go to acquisition.com/roadmap.
00:40:14You can plug in your business information.
00:40:16And if you want our help, you want my help,
00:40:18to help you break through whatever level of scaling
00:40:20you're at, this is not a promise.
00:40:21I'm just saying we'd love to help.
00:40:22On the thank you page, you can book a call.
00:40:25Every month we have a workshop out here at my headquarters.
00:40:27You actually talk to my real team that does our marketing,
00:40:31does our emails, does our ads, does our copy,
00:40:32does our sales, does our finance, does our recruiting.
00:40:36The real people are doing this at a very high level.
00:40:38And what's really cool about that is that they can typically
00:40:40find and spot what the constraints are in a business
00:40:42like that.
00:40:43And so it's one of the most valuable things
00:40:44that I could possibly do.
00:40:45Obviously, you know, space is limited
00:40:47based on our actual headquarters.
00:40:48But if that's interesting, on the thank you page,
00:40:50you can book a call.
00:40:50No pressure.
00:40:51This is a gift either way.
00:40:52It's absolutely free.

Key Takeaway

To scale beyond the limits of media arbitrage, e-commerce founders must transition from being tactical practitioners to brand-focused investors who prioritize talent acquisition and defensible market positioning.

Highlights

Scaling an e-commerce business requires treating ad spend as an investment in finding "money printing" keywords rather than a loss.

For service-based businesses, a virtuous cycle of high-quality work leads to higher demand, allowing for better talent acquisition and price increases.

The 'Direct Response Doom Loop' occurs when scaling media arbitrage leads to rising customer acquisition costs and shrinking margins without a strong brand.

Building a defensible brand is more critical for long-term survival than relying solely on legal patents or low-margin media arbitrage.

Founders should focus on their core high-value skills and delegate 'junk drawer' tasks to contractors or virtual assistants to maintain growth momentum.

Transitioning from a successful physical product business to SaaS is often a 'sunk cost fallacy' trap that ignores the extreme difficulty of software development.

In live-selling businesses, scaling is achieved by training others using concrete behavioral descriptions rather than amorphous concepts like 'energy' or 'charisma'.

Timeline

Introduction and the $100M Experience

Alex Hormozi opens the video by establishing his credentials, citing the $46.2 million sale of Prestige Labs and a record-breaking $106 million weekend book launch. He emphasizes that the goal of this Q&A session is to provide tactical solutions for e-commerce business owners looking to scale their operations immediately. The first caller, Max from Elevate Customs, introduces his luxury gaming table manufacturing business which currently generates $2.5 million in annual revenue. Max expresses a desire to reach $10 million in revenue but struggles with lead generation efficiency. This opening sets the stage for a discussion on the shift from being a hands-on entrepreneur to a strategic investor.

Scaling Google Ads and Keyword Investment

The discussion focuses on Max's current ad spend of $20,000 per month and why simply spending more hasn't yielded better quality leads. Hormozi argues that at this spending level, the market for custom gaming tables is nowhere near saturated and suggests the issue lies in media buying and keyword selection. He encourages the founder to view 'bad spend' as an investment to discover the high-performing keywords that can support $100,000 in monthly spend. By reframing the mindset from entrepreneur to investor, Hormozi highlights that profit should be used as 'fodder' to reach the next level of business growth. He stresses that finding a few winning keywords can essentially create a money-printing machine for the company.

Reinvestment Strategies for Service Businesses

Hormozi takes a 'side quest' to explain how service businesses should reinvest their excess cash flow since they lack traditional capital expenditures like machinery. He identifies two primary areas for reinvestment: talent/culture and brand development. A virtuous cycle is described where better work generates more demand, which allows for higher prices, which in turn funds the hiring of even better talent. He explains that if a business cannot charge more than its competitors, it is simply because the service provided is not yet superior. This section emphasizes that brand building involves 'aspirational moments' and big demonstrations that solidify the company's reputation beyond direct response advertising.

The 5 Levels of Customer Awareness

Using the framework of legendary marketer Eugene Schwartz, Hormozi explains the five levels of customer awareness: unaware, problem aware, solution aware, product aware, and most aware. He points out that most businesses fail to scale because they only target the 'most aware' customers who are already looking for their specific product. To tap into an 'ocean' of cheaper clicks, a business must create 'bridge pages' or advertorials that speak to people who are only problem aware. This involves changing the hook to meet the customer where they are and leading them through a journey toward the product. He concludes this segment by offering a free 10-stage roadmap for scaling from zero to $100 million.

Delegation and the Contractor Bench

A second founder, Ethan, shares his experience running a $3 million direct-response e-commerce business with only four SKUs. Ethan complains about being stuck with a 'junk drawer' of specialized but tedious tasks that only take 20 minutes a week but clutter his schedule. Hormozi advises building a 'bench' of contractors and virtual assistants who can be turned on and off for sporadic project work, such as video editing or Shopify maintenance. He notes that as a founder's time is freed up from these low-leverage tasks, they can focus on high-value strategic moves. The core advice here is to keep trading your time for revenue-supported roles until you are managing people rather than tasks.

The Direct Response Doom Loop vs. Brand

Hormozi warns Ethan about the 'Direct Response Doom Loop,' where scaling leads to rising acquisition costs, shrinking margins, and supply chain headaches. He observes that media arbitrage businesses usually cap out around $10 million to $12 million in revenue before becoming high-liability non-profits. To avoid this, he suggests focusing on a single 'winning' product and building a legitimate brand around it rather than managing a portfolio of mediocre items. He emphasizes that private equity investors buy brands with defensibility and loyal audiences, not just products with good current math. Building a brand through influencer recruitment and superior product reinforcement is presented as the only way to reach a $500 million valuation.

Avoiding the SaaS Sunk Cost Trap

Samantha, a salon owner and extension wholesaler, expresses a desire to move into SaaS because she believes her current business is too operationally heavy. Hormozi identifies this as 'Shiny Object Syndrome' and warns her that building a software company is significantly harder than running her current successful businesses. He points out the 'sunk cost fallacy' when she mentions she has already started paying for the software build, advising her that stopping bad spend is sometimes the best investment. He argues that her current extension business is actually 'chill' and cash-flow positive compared to the seven-year profitless grind of SaaS. He encourages her to stick to the niche where she already has distribution and trust.

Optimizing a Cash-Flow Positive Business

Continuing the conversation with Samantha, Hormozi dissects the actual constraints of her hair extension business, which has grown 100% this year. He explains that recurring revenue (SaaS) and reoccurring revenue (consumable extensions) have similar value if retention is demonstrated. Instead of pivotng to software, he suggests she focus on improving her current margins and acquisition strategies for stylists. He provides a tactical play: teach stylists how to make more money using her extensions so they become loyal, long-term trade customers. This section reinforces the idea that founders should double down on their 'unfair advantage' rather than starting over in a field where they have no experience.

Scaling Live Sales through Behavioral Training

The final caller, Sasha, runs a $6 million luxury handbag business on the 'Whatnot' platform and wants to scale to $38 million. Sasha's main bottleneck is exhaustion from being the primary on-camera salesperson and struggling with recruiting warehouse staff. Hormozi suggests outsourcing logistics to a 3PL and focusing entirely on training new on-camera talent. He emphasizes that training must be based on 'concrete behavioral language' (e.g., 'speak faster,' 'shoulders back') rather than vague terms like 'have charisma.' By breaking down successful sales techniques into observable actions, a founder can more quickly build a stable of performers. The video concludes with an invitation for viewers to use his scaling roadmap to identify their own business constraints.

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